July 23, 2014

Wow, just wow

Pure hatred of one's fellow human looks at lot like this:

Speaking at this year’s Christians United for Israel gala, Israeli ambassador to the United States Ron Dermer claimed that, contrary to what human rights groups and the United Nations have claimed, the Israeli Defense Force (IDF) has conducted its assault on Hamas in Gaza with such caution and care for civilian lives that it deserves a Nobel Peace Prize for “unimaginable restraint.”

“Some are shamelessly accusing Israel of genocide and would put us in the dock for war crimes,” Dermer said during a speech that was repeatedly interrupted by protestors. “But the truth is that the Israeli Defense Forces should be given the Nobel Peace Prize … for fighting with unimaginable restraint.”

Dermer went on to compare Israel’s warfare with that of the United Kingdom during World War II, arguing that while he had no interest in criticizing Winston Churchill for his decision to repeatedly bomb civilians in Germany, the nearly 70-year-old historical example was a reminder that, when it comes to protecting civilian life, Israel could be doing much worse.

“[N]o one should accept criticism of Israel for acting with restraint that has not been shown and would not be shown by any nation on Earth,” Dermer continued. “I especially will not tolerate criticism of my country at a time when Israeli soldiers are dying so that innocent Palestinians can live.”
 Israeli ambassador to US says IDF deserves nobel peace prize for unimaginable restraint 

The ambassador expanded, as if he could possibly improve on his first comments:

Israeli Ambassador to the U.S. Ron Dermer on Tuesday defended the country’s military action against Hamas in Gaza, but acknowledged the growing number of civilian deaths and said Israel is “not perfect.”

“I don’t think Israel should be judged by a standard of perfection,” Dermer told reporters at breakfast sponsored by the Christian Science Monitor. “We’re not perfect, we make mistakes.”

Dermer said repeatedly that Israel was not targeting Palestinian civilians and insisted Hamas was using human shields “in an unprecedented way,” which he argued was leading to the large number of civilian deaths.

Dermer also said people should asked themselves how other countries would react if in a similar situation.
“We are in a situation where we have to defend our people, and we’re doing it in ways that other countries have not done and would not done,” Dermer said. “If 200 million Americans were sitting in bomb shelters day after day, the U.S. military, the U.S. government, would not take action that is less forceful than Israel.”
Dermer noted a recent incident in which Hamas fighters and civilians were killed by Israeli forces.

“In this case, none of those people [civilians] should have been there,” he said. “Forty-eight hours before, we told everybody to get out of those areas and to go. We told them exactly where they should go to get out of the way of the fighting. A lot of them chose to stay. Some of them, I think, were forced to stay.”

Dermer also rephrased reported comments he made Monday that the Israeli Defense Forces should receive a Nobel Peace Prize for its “unimaginable restraint.” On Tuesday, he instead said Israel should earn global admiration.

“A missile can hit the wrong place, you can have intelligence failure, but we don’t target civilians. And I think, given the fact that we’ve got our people in bomb shelters, I think Israel should earn the admiration of the international community for the restraint that it has shown in the face of these threats,” Dermer said.
Israeli official: 'We're not perfect'

37 comments:

  1. Its a disgraceful suggestion that the IDF deserves the Nobel Peace Prize.

    Disgraceful.

    It shows how far ordinary moral standards have deteriorated in the face of Middle East imperialism and its Western urgers.

    The IDF is far too good and moral for the Nobel Peace Prize

    Something more like this is only fair.


    http://geofffff.blogspot.com.au/2012/04/geoffffs-joint-peace-prize.html

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  2. The conflict has claimed more than 600 lives - including those of 149 children - in three weeks.

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  3. I do not accept those figures because they are sourced with Hamas and I'm hoping Hamas has been that successful in murdering Gaza kids. This, could be accurate, but likely not,hopefully.
    Anyway I do not accept Israeli culpability, do not believe Israel has any choice and on the available evidence has achieved a new standard of duty in the face of a regime that does its best to see kids killed to exploit propaganda value.

    There is always the same angle to this. 600 lives is pretty terrible and the number of kids is bloody horrible if that figure is even remotely true. But the same number of people are being killed in a day, or an hour, in Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, North Africa and dozens of other places at times where Islamic imperialism is on the rampage.. Thousands murdered every day.mostly women and kids in the way.Heaps of dead Muslims all over the place.
    ISS just stoned two women to death in public for adultery in Iraq since grabbing its enclave a week ago.

    Yet Gaza gets the attention of all these places put together and then multiplied by six.

    There is something at play there that needs an explanation. Don't ask me. What ever I have to say about it won't be pretty but I think it is just true that Israel cops a disproportionate hiding because it is basically a decent place where critics can say what they like in safety

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    1. http://geofffff.blogspot.com.au/2014/07/comes-antistate.html

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  4. Anonymous11:05 PM

    Racial Theories of Zionism

    "Jabotinsky {Zionist Revisionist} incorporated his racial theories of Zionism from the international eugenics movement, whose leading proponents wrote Hitler's racial theories. In 1913, he wrote a document that could have been used by the German Nazi Party. "Let us draw for ourself the ideal type of an 'absolute nation,'|" he wrote. "It would have to possess a racial appearance of marked unique character, an appearance different from the racial nature of that nation's neighbors. It would have to occupy from time immemorial a continuous and clearly defined piece of land; it would be highly desirable if in that area there would be no alien minorities, who would weaken national unity. It would have to maintain an original national language, which is not derived from another nation."


    The internet is so full of lies and misinformation I'm sure the quote above is an example.



    j

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  5. “You need to understand that Palestinian blood has been shed by Hamas itself," a 28-year old journalist who asked not to be identified told FoxNews.com. "Living under Hamas is a tragedy.”

    Since Israel's operation began Hamas has fired more than 2,300 rockets at Israel, including one that struck near enough to Ben Gurion Airport to prompt a 48-hour ban on most international flights in and out. While the rocket attacks have been largely neutralized by Israel's Iron Dome defense system, the incursion into the Palestinian enclave has left an estimated 140,000 Gazans displaced.

    “Nobody can forgive Hamas for what they’re doing," the journalist said. "No one can forgive Hamas for butchering Palestinians to get power. Most Gazans hate Hamas with a passion."

    There is fear of speaking out against Hamas, which is why many have stayed quiet until now, according to the source, an editor at a local Gazan media outlet.

    “The only reason Hamas rules Gaza is because of its ruthless iron fist and military dictatorship," he said. "We would love to have an independence from both Fatah and Hamas, who are profiting off the Palestinian people. We need to rule ourselves"

    “No normal human being can watch what’s going on and still support Hamas. I beg the Israeli army to understand that Hamas uses civilians, while their own leaders (like Mashaal) are hiding in Qatar.”
    http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/07/25/war-weary-gazans-lash-out-at-hamas-over-refusal-cease-fire/


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  6. Hamas is a Johnny come lately to all of this. How nice it would be if it was all their fault, solution would be simple. And it IS much touted that 'if only Hamas was gone' ... what? Nothing would change.

    Can't recall all the news stories, past or current of Hamas butchering their own. No UN motions about that one. I'm sure they're not nice, I think that's pretty obvious. But as with other parties of which we'd hope people in other countries would never want, Hamas was voted into power. Yes, there were 'violent clashes' during that election. That's Islam. Religion of peace. The people in Gaza chose Hamas pretty decisively.

    Meanwhile, there's Israel, the religion of god's 'chosen people'.

    They are all damned by this never ending hate.

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    1. Hamas is the "Palestinian" front for the Muslim Brotherhood. The Muslim Brotherhood is NOT a new player in this.

      "Meanwhile, there's Israel, the religion of god's 'chosen people'."

      It is not the Jews who believe that their religion is everyone's law. They don't even believe it is their law.

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  7. The difference is, that Israel unlike Hamas do not use their own people as human shields. The never ending hate appears to be coming from Hamas. Do you know that Gazans are still admitted for treatment in Israeli hospitals?

    The Palestinians and Gazans may have elected Hamas, but many now realize the folly of that mistake.

    "While Gazans' anger at Israel has almost certainly grown amid the Israeli incursion, which has seen the destruction of schools and hospitals, where Israel claims Hamas has hidden rockets, resentment toward Hamas surfaced in local reports this week after Hamas' Qatar-based leader Khaled Mashaal refused to agree to a cease fire absent a lifting of blockades and a release of political prisoners.

    “The conditions he put means there will never be an end to this war,” said Mudhar Zahran, a PALESTINIAN POLITICIAN, said from his home in the West Bank. “Gazans were cursing him."

    "None of this is to deny the very real suffering of Gazans. No rational person interested in their welfare would govern the way Hamas does. Its technical proficiency is smuggling. Its infrastructure program consists of building tunnels for acts of murder and kidnapping. Its civil-defense system is to admonish endangered civilians not to heed Israeli warnings to flee buildings about to be hit. Its peace plan is annihilation of the Jewish state.

    It can’t achieve that by force of arms. Its objective is, with support from fellow travelers and useful idiots the world over, to make Israel the new South Africa, toward the goal of its ultimate destruction. If it takes countless dead Palestinians to do it, so be it."



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  8. Yes, Israel has used the 'human shield' defence for killing woman and children for a long time now, yet oddly, weapons are almost never found around the destroyed houses or bodies of the dead civilians. Funny that.

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    1. Actually they are nearly always found. Israel's intelligence is very nearly impeccable on this. Hundreds of Hamas gun men have been killed. .

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  9. Last week the UN advised Israel 12 times of the coordinates of a school, and pleaded to be given safe option to evacuate. No permission came for evacuation of a school known to be providing shelter, and then Israel dropped a bomb on it. Couldn't miss, after all, they did have the coordinates.

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  10. Not to over state the case, have to concede that missiles have been found at that UN school, twice in recent times, but why not let them evacuate, and no missiles were there at the time Israel chose to bomb.

    Of course, as The Australian noted on the front page yesterday, the whole of Gaza is one big human shield. One of the most densely populated bits of land on Earth, with around 5000 people per km. And yes, finding somewhere to hide missiles wouldn't be an issue if Hamas would only stop collecting them and lobbing them into Israel. Meanwhile, there are missiles amongst the people, because there's nowhere else to put them.

    Everyone is damned.

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    1. Actually that was not the Australian that made that asinine and dishonest comment.

      It was John Lyons. Most of the Australian's commentary has been exemplary. Only one weird little in creep in wood work.

      http://geofffff.blogspot.com.au/2014/07/what-does-hamas-want.html


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  11. No, the Brotherhood isn’t new, any more than Islam would be considered to be ‘new’.

    Hamas, to the best of my knowledge didn’t turn down a two state solution once, twice, three times, four times … over the last 50 years. No, it was other Palestinian leaders who did that.

    Funny how there was no solution for 60 plus years, but right now the misleading insistence is that if not for Hamas all would be well. This is blatantly untrue. If not Hamas there would be some other reason for Israel to continue occupation and killing, some other person in Gaza turning down any chance of a peace deal. So in that regard, it really doesn’t matter a damn who’s running the show on either side, does it. We all know this.

    Yes hundreds of Israeli soldiers have died. That’s what happens to soldiers in wars.

    Tens of thousands of Palestinian women and children have died.

    One life is more valued than the other, yes, I get that – apparently Palestinian lives have no value – not under Hamas, not under any other political party.

    The great irony continues, of course: Islam wants to destroy Israel, and the West, and despite concerted efforts have been dismal failures at wiping out Israel, yet Israel quietly goes about the business of wiping out Palestinians – if not literally, then at least their ability to work, learn and live.

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  12. "Hamas, to the best of my knowledge didn’t turn down a two state solution once, twice, three times, four times … over the last 50 years. No, it was other Palestinian leaders who did that. "

    Not true. Hamas is utterly opposed to a two state solution. In fact all the Pal faction and gang bosses are.even the "moderates", when they talk about this, really mean a twp Palestinian state solution. But no sovereign Israel. Ever.

    It is curious so many do not appreciate how intransigent the Pals are. There is just no understanding of the situation and the biggest furphy is that there is a Palestinian polity of any kind that are free agents in setting strategy and policy. There is not. All the shots are called by Iran, MB, and the Sunni dynasties and slave states of the Gulf.

    Israel is attacked for not reaching a "political solution". The truth is there is no "political solution" to be had for one reason, and only one reason. No Arab or Muslim country can ever concede non-Muslim sovereignty over this land and its cities especially Jerusalem. Never. Not ever. Such a thing would be to defy the will of God.

    Extremist Islamists do really believe this stuff with everything they have they really do despise you for not. That's where the relative values of human life comes into it.

    Extremist Islam rules the official ideologies of most of the countries in that part of the world, or it is the Opposition that regimes compete with for the people and power structures.

    This is why there will never be a Pal state. Never. It is because the Pals don't want a Pal state as a place for Pal nationhood. A Pal state is the last thing Hamas wants. Or Fatah for that matter. They would be out of business forever.

    The Pal want the destruction of another state and its supercession by some kind of abomination that is necessarily thin on detail, given it is never going to happen, but would for certain have the Pals fighting one civil war after another over what the national abomination represents and who controls it.

    There will never be a Pal state until there is some kind of revolution that among other things sweeps away the monstrosity of political Islam

    http://geofffff.blogspot.com.au/2014/07/comes-antistate.html

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  13. Turns out the Israelis didn't kill those in kids in that school after all.

    Hamas did it.

    Just that everybody decided it was best to blame the Jews for all the dead kids even though this is a battle and it is in the nature of battles that loose ordinance flies about killing civilians and very frequently soldiers on your side.

    And Hamas ordinance is the loosest ordinance of all. .

    http://cifwatch.com/2014/07/27/breaking-video-suggests-idf-mortars-did-not-play-role-in-beit-hanoun-killing/

    Why am I not surprised?

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  14. Shite Geoffff, my point was that every other fucker leading Palestinians in the past has turned down options for a solution; got nothing to do with what Hamas does or doesn't support.

    I note the source of the blog is not the BBC or the ABC or the UN.

    I also note the wonders of Israel bombs never hitting their target. Fooking amazing.

    It's not merely having cake and eating it. It's cake, cookies and roast lamb, and eating them.

    So, it's not that Palestinians are used as human shields, it's that Hamas keeps killing their own.

    Meanwhile, who are the Israeli rockets and soldiers killing?

    This fucking splitting hairs thing is one that REALLY pisses me off about this never ending, obscene and costly disaster. Everyone gets to pick out a grain of sand to deflect all responsibility, entirely forgetting the shit and blood soak beach, which the rest of us can still see.

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    1. "I note the source of the blog is not the BBC or the ABC or the UN. "

      It's not the Guardian either.

      That's because I still aspire to a level of credibility when it comes to linking sources.

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  15. Actually their own enquiry claims the school yard was EMPTY - NOT that the mortar wasn't theirs.

    Specifically: a single errant mortar - theirs.


    Since Thursday, July 24, 2014, the IDF has conducted a comprehensive inquiry regarding the incident in which the UNRWA school was fired upon. The inquiry concluded that during the intense fighting between IDF forces and Hamas militants, the militants operated adjacent to the UNRWA school. The militants fired anti-tank missiles at IDFsoldiers, who then responded by firing several mortars in their direction.

    The inquiry and the documented footage presented here concluded that a single errant mortar landed in the courtyard of the UNRWA school, when it was completely empty.

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    1. I look forward to seeing the video from Hamas proving it wasn't their anti-tank missile, errant or otherwise, that killed the kids.

      Israel's missiles and artillery are not fail proof and in any event there's a human with his finger on the trigger and they most certainly are not fail proof. But killing civilians is a mistake, a military failure, for the Israelis. The IDF and IAF is not 100% on the mark but it could be as high as 95%, or even 99%, which to be very frank about it, it is the absolute best that any modern military can do.

      Of course there is a "tolerance" limit built into all military calculations. Of course it is known that civilian casualties will be unavoidable in an operation like this. But there is not the slightest overlap of moral equivalence between Israel and Hamas. Not so much as a cigarette paper

      For Israel, killing kids is a terrible blunder that distresses the country. For Hamas, child murder is policy.

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  16. A blog reporting a self-evaluation, and which is quite honest. No denial in the report about the hit being from them.

    Although I have no idea how they are reconciling an empty playground with 15 dead and many wounded. But I don't pay much attention to these diversions, because that's all they are.

    Look, over there, a grain of sand!

    This never ever changes. Trillions of words have been devoted to this very thing. It's a tactic that works, as peope obsess over the grains.

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    1. I have said this about the whole Arab/Zionist conflict from the start.

      Take 1948. The year of the great Nakba that strides over Arab terminal victim hood like the colossus of cry babies on cocaine.. The worst thing to have ever happened to anyone ever. Worse than the Holocaust had it really happened. The meanest worsted thing to have ever been done ever that must be commemorated with some annual bullshit fucking march and shit like upside down Anzac Day in hell.

      Fuckwits.

      Anyway I digress..

      Think just for a second what else was going on 1948.

      India partitioned as part of independence and left to itself. 100 000 's killed in ethnic wars. Vast massacres and atrocities everywhere. Famine of course. Millions uprooted and marching away from everything they have forever. Can you imagine the human misery in that?

      The China civil war was in full swing as had been for years, or the Mao revolution was, or both. Don't ask details but anyway millions being killed and a really dangerous war, Or revolution. Whatever

      All kinds of shit going on in South America. You've read those novels.

      On and on it goes. Europe was a complete basket case with civilian populations starving. Stalin was at the peak of his manic murderous empire that now reached to Berlin . Millions of people being bashed around by the Hitler like madman psychopath.

      A spit across the Med and there was the Greek civil war at its ugly worst. That was real nasty. Civil wars always especially are. Anyway heaps more nasty than what was going on in the frigging land between the river the sea even at the worst of it for the poor fucking Pals

      So fuck it. Isn't it about time it was said?

      The "Palestinians" should stop fucking whinging! Grow up you whiny little bunch of overwrought layabuts.

      Get a haircut. Smarten up act. Get a job.

      The whole fucking Antistate of fucking "Palestine" or whatever these sleazy barbarians want to call themselves after they've sorted out their filthy murderous civil wars.

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  17. Getting back to one particular grain of sand for a moment. It is official.

    Israel has declared it was not responsible for the strike on the UNWRA school.

    http://www.algemeiner.com/2014/07/27/israel-says-deaths-in-unrwa-school-were-not-caused-by-idf-fire/

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  18. Anonymous8:26 PM

    Zionist Israel doesn't want peace, they just want the Arabs to pack up and leave, that should be bloody obvious by now, you can't rob real estate when at peace. And if them Arabs fight back then you clobber them big time, if they won't leave then kill em. That's what the game is all about, has been since day one - all in all the history books tell the story.

    If someone stole your stuff what what you do, what does history teach us about the behaviour of people who have their land, dignity and freedom taken from them?

    Anyway that's now, but what about the future?

    There may come a day in the not too distant when the world's reserve currency is no longer so - in fact it is slowly dying the death of a thousand cuts as we breathe, and big money knows it.

    So what of Zionist Israel when the US can longer create debt (out of thin air) to fund their wars and empire?

    One day Zionist Israel may have to make a decision - whether to get down on their knees and beg forgiveness, or use the Sampson Option.

    j

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    1. I can't see them ever doing either, Justin. They won't ever seek forgiveness, and the Sampson option would be too galling for them.

      Such is pride, arrogance, hubris.

      Maybe something good will come when Hamas is gone, but every precedent tells us that won't be the case, as per my previous comments, I don't even know how often they vote - must be only once a decade? A long time since the last vote.

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    2. Abbas is into the eighth year of a three year term.



      .

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  19. I have such a gutful of this preachy sick culture of victim hood and really gross everlasting injustice

    The poor fucking Pals.

    Check out 1948 the year of the mother of all human rights outrages, the Nakba. The standard by which all the great Outrages are measured.

    Heaps of Jews were killled about 6- 7000 including 4000 troops. Maybe 20000 Arabs including both invading troops and Pal irregulars and at least 3000 civilians. Many more wounded in the same proportion. Many Arabs uprooted permanently but under one million .Many Jews uprooted permanently or about to be but under one million.

    Terrible. But that was the worst of it and the Pals must face something true

    That would barely have been a village skirmish on a typical afternoon in China at the time.

    Get over it Pals, Or fuck off with the barbaric death cult.

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  20. Interesting baseline that you're using - 1948.

    In proportion, if it was Americans being killed over the last fortnight, it would come to around 175,000 dead.

    Or looking at actual figures, around three domestic plane loads of Palestinians dead.

    Yet you say Pals, and the rest us, should get over it.

    What an extraordinary way to view lots of dead women and children. I have to assume you would be equally indifferent if the dead were in your suburb, bodies strewn about the place.

    Of course, there are far more being slaughtered in Syria, for example, but no one seems to give a shit, other than a bi-monthly hand wringing, to fill in the space when it's a slow news day.

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    1. I'm talking about the Nakba of 1948. Not Gaza , or Israel now.

      The point is that Israel/Palestine was nothing in 1948 compared to what else was going on in 1948. Yet they have picked it up as if it a grain of sand on a beach with a pair of tweezers and focused on it with a telescope to the exclusion of everything else as if the national liberation of the Jews in their homeland was the greatest travesty of history and nothing else really happened.

      To hell with the Pals. Have you seen those tunnels and bunkers those arse holes have built? A moment thought please about the vast expenditure of resources. Hundreds of miles. Dozens of tunnels to within metres of kibbutzim. Plans to launch raids of a thousand terrorists and more to overwhelm the Israelis and kill as many as can.

      600 000 tons of concrete poured. Let me say that slowly. 600 000 tons. Enough materials to build dozens of major apartment blocks. Vast manpower. Hundreds killed in industrial accidents building the tunnels including 160 kids. Every single kilo came from Israel imported by the UN or an NGO as being for a major civilian project.

      Remember that the next time you hear them weep for the poor bloody blockaded fucking Pals. Think of the vast weaponry, the arsenal these mongrels on steroids had stashed the next time you hear lies about food and medicine shortages.

      Look at those fucking tunnels. Vast underground caverns..Missiles that reach all of Israel. It's like having to bring down a James Bond villain .

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  21. Listen to this young girl at Rita's place for a moment to get an idea of what its like to live in Israel anywhere near these savages.

    http://littlenotesfromparis.blogspot.com.au/

    Rita doesn't mince words. Great little blog

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  22. Yes, indeed. On the other side of the same coin, it's a barrel of laughs living in Gaza. It's a hoot. Because they aren't real people.

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  23. http://www.smh.com.au/world/un-official-christopher-gunness-breaks-down-on-live-tv-following-attack-on-gaza-school-20140731-zyr9x.html

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  24. Anonymous8:47 PM

    We cannot give any compensation for Palestine, neither to the Palestinians nor to other Arabs. Therefore, a voluntary agreement is inconceivable. All colonization, even the most restricted, must continue in defiance of the will of the native population. Therefore, it can continue and develop only under the shield of force which comprises an Iron Wall which the local population can never break through. This is our Arab policy. To formulate it any other way would be hypocrisy.~Ze'ev Jabotinsky (The Iron Wall (1923)

    j

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    1. Mate, if you are quoting the CEC as your authority then you are lost.

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    2. Jabotinsky is my latest hero. I never realised how much I have in common with him until I read a brief bio recently.

      Do you know there is no evidence that he set foot inside a functioning synagogue in his life past child hood?

      Not once.

      Whatta man.

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  25. Anonymous8:05 PM

    I thought it was a Jabotinski quote Geoffff.

    Here's a quote from another source, a bunch of nutters really but hey they, like Henry Kissenger, make an observation worthy of consideration:

    Beinart notes that Israel’s American supporters are gradually dying off: “According to Gallup, while Americans over the age of 65 support Israel’s actions by a margin of 24 points, Americans under 30 oppose them by a margin of 26 points.” It seems inevitable that in the not-so-distant future, the US – Israel’s lone supporter on the world stage – will turn against the Zionist entity. When that happens, Kissinger’s prophecy that Israel will cease to exist will be fulfilled.

    Israel’s leaders know that time, history, and demographics are working against them. They know that apartheid South Africa, a racist regime that was not nearly as vicious or genocidal as Israel, was erased from the pages of time by a changing current of global public opinion very similar to today’s rising tide of anti-Zionism.

    The rats in Israel have their backs to the wall. They are cornered, and they know it. And as they blindly lash out in useless fury by mass-murdering ever-increasing numbers of helpless women and children, they are simply hastening their own inevitable demise.


    j

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